The updated statement reads much more clearly like a (financial/enrollment) turf war between parochial schools and homeschooling, with a gloss of the good Cardinal assuming that families where parochial religious ed isn’t working aren’t good faith community members.
I am curious about that - I wonder if the diocese considers charter schools or non-Catholic private schools to be less of a competitor? Where I live, many empty Catholic schools are rented out to other private or charter schools or in some cases even regular public schools that have to temporarily vacate their building for whatever reason.
I'm more wondering about why the diocese considers homeschooling to be competition, rather than cooperation. The goal is to get children educated and formed well, particularly in the Catholic Faith, not to make tuition money. It's the non-Catholic and public schools that are in opposition to that.
There are a lot of homeschoolers that would be perfectly fine with a hybrid solution, where their kids do some things (like sports, or maybe a class the parents are weak on) in a conventional school. As a general rule, (there are exceptions) this is denied. Colleges don't refuse to let people take classes by ones and twos, it's children's schools that want full control.
"The statement also noted that the new diocesan policy was approved by the Presbyteral Council by a vote of 13-1."
-Interesting. Considering that homeschooled Catholic children in the diocese make up a small percentage of students and the makeup of the Presbyteral Council is unknown (how many of them even HAVE school age children, know anybody who does, or is free from unfounded bias against them), it's somewhat surprising that there was a single NO vote.
It is like polling a pack of wolves with one sheep on whether or not the sheep should be eaten. The head wolf has spoken.
A presbyteral council (autocorrect is convinced I meant Presbyterian) is made of priests, so I just assume the outlier is the one who was homeschooled. Statistically speaking.
As a parent of two children in Catholic Schools in San Diego, the Cardinal should consider that our parish schools are cost-prohibitive for many families, especially families with numerous children. We live in one of the most expensive cities in America. Perhaps the local Church could fund more scholarship opportunities for faithful families to be able to afford their local parish school instead of the growing number of non-Catholics (who should be welcomed, but not at the expense of Catholic families).
Maybe if diocesan schools were more faithful to the church and offered financial flexibility to middle and lower income parents there would be families that would choose those schools over homeschooling.
The state of Ohio pretty much now has open season on private school funding by vouchers.
What do the Catholic schools do? They conveniently raise tuition to absorb the vouchers (taxpayer money). And Catholic school enrollment remains flat, the vouchers are inducing zero enrollment growth.
Pick you subsidy wisely, the good government may just tax you for both public and private school instead of just public school.
Not entirely true; only state charter schools are funded by vouchers. I work at a non-chartered private school in Ohio that would greatly benefit from the voucher program but we are ineligible because we are not chartered.
I do agree, however, that it is a real shame that enrollment levels across the board have not gone up, likely because the new scholarship opportunity is not being advertised on a school-by-school basis. It is, of course, entirely just that those families already paying taxes for public schools and extra for private schools can now stop paying double for their children's education, but the expansion is not currently achieving what it was intended to do.
Given the cardinal's support for ordaining women to the priesthood, why should any parent trust that the Diocese of San Diego's Catholic schools faithfully teach the Faith & not the cardinal's personal "Catholicism"?
Our Catholic schools suck. They are apostasy factories, and not even that great academically. We need to stop telling ourselves pleasantries and platitudes to make us feel better. We need to be brutally honest about how terrible 99.999% of Catholic schools are in the US. They are totally broken spiritually and academically, and we need to be very real with ourselves about that.
If only people truly knew how bad things really are. There's far too many points of critical failure to list in a single comment (or even a single thread), because the "Catholic/parochial school model" is totally broken. It's not just a question of better funding or of reforming certain schools; the whole model is so bankrupt and broken that it's nigh-unfixable.
I graduated from one of the "best Catholic schools" in the state of Wisconsin, a large well-funded K-12 institution. That same school has a 1% "Catholic retention rate" over 10 years post-graduation, meaning 99% of students apostasize within 10 years in average.
You are fully entitled to your personal sentiment or opinion. But using “Trumpian superlatives” is not convincing. And how can you correlate a 99% apostasy rate to only your single Catholic school when the US church overall has been such a living, breathing debacle (sex abuse scandal and cover-ups, financial mismanagement, near-schism over traditionalist “beauty” vs. Sacrosanctum Concilium paragraph knowing/active/fruitful participation) the last 40-50 years?
I too am demoralized after well over 60 years, but Catholic schools (at least of my era, the 1970’s and what I see thereafter in parishes of my travels) are way farther down the list for realities sending the faithful out the exits.
I’m sure there are facts supporting a wide array of perspectives and spare all of us more “Trumpian superlatives” somewhere near infinity.
I think he is saying that his school, having polled the graduates, has a 1% retention rate. I think it is not a superlative, and no one brought up Trump.
From what I understand, the average retention rate for Catholic children in general is something like 7%, so horrifically bad. But you would expect a revered Catholic school to do much better for their Catholic students, not much worse.
A related personal aside: I attended K-12 Catholic school. Had a “religious ed” class each year. When I reverted in my 20s, I was floored to discover that a bishop was a “successor to the apostles” and that an unbroken line of ordination connected him to one of the 12. I grew up thinking that if you were a priest for long enough, eventually you just got a pay rise and a funny hat. That’s the level of catechesis we received.
I don’t know anyone from my class who authentically practices, outside of one friend who I’ve been trying to nudge into reinvigorating his faith (though he lives far away, he’s an amazing dude).
I hope the bishops are discussing this because it fits with my anecdotal observations, too. I know mature adults, young adults, and in between who matriculated from Catholic schools and know nearly zero about how to articulate their Faith or their reasons for holding it. And while an ability to write a Thomistic thesis is not necessary for salvation or earnest and fruitful living of the Faith, complete ignorance makes a soul an easy target.
I am sorry to hear of your experience and of the failure of many Catholic schools like the one you attended. It does not, however, represent the whole of the present reality. As a parent with school age children and many such friends, calling the project of Catholic schools futile doesn’t ring true.
It doesn’t seem as though you’re aware of the Institute for Catholic Liberal Education, for instance, and it’s affiliate schools. There’s a serious change going on in Catholic education, and it’s not limited to those adopting the “classical model.”
Of course we can’t know how many present students will hold to the faith amidst a hostile culture. But there’s reason to believe that some of our schools offer the best chance for many of their students.
It’s probably not the majority of schools at this point, but the demographics are trending in that direction.
ICLE does good work, but how many of its affiliated schools are actually part of the parochial or diocesan school systems? A lot of the best Catholic schools, like the Chesterton network, are actually independent and "in the Catholic tradition", not Catholic in the sense of being subject to the bishops.
Did you know that I used to be a teacher in Catholic schools? Did you know I’m very well aware of the ICLE, and even attended their annual conference and workshops?
Maybe it’s your experience that’s not reflective of the overwhelming trend?
“America is car-dependent” “That’s not true, my friends and I are all from NYC and we all use public transit”
Most people on the internet here know you as their guy with dead Lybian dictator as profile pic… hardly screams average Catholic school teacher and you didn’t mention you were a teacher in your initial comment.
In Australia the average level of practice of families in Catholic Schools is… 2%. Ie, out of 100 students, two go to mass at least once a month. And half those kids stop going to mass within 12 months of graduating. The only Mass that the average Catholic school student attends is the ones provided during school hours. Australia has a large and well funded Catholic school system with about 70% of funding being provided by the state, in exchange for catholic schools educating 1/3 of all Australian Children for a nominal fee (compared to fully private schools where a ‘cheap one’ starts at $20k a year).
Bishop Anthony Fisher (I think, I’m conversation) once described Catholic schools as a vaccine against Catholicism… it exposed kids to just enough Catholicism to make them immune to it for life!
Sounds like a parish needs to start a school employing an innovative model where most schooling is done by parents, sometimes collectively in a schoolroom setting and sometimes separately at home, with the parish providing educational oversight. Such a model would reduce costs for parishes and families, increase access to Catholic education, facilitate greater parental involvement in the education of their children, and improve fellowship between members of the parish, compared to the traditional model. It’s a win-win-win-win.
Hybrid classical schools in my area fill up as fast as they open registration. None in my area is Catholic, but if my diocese opened one they would max it for numbers without a doubt.
My kids attend a classical Catholic school and it has been at maximum enrollment every year since it opened. It's not a diocesan school, and it's probably not as inexpensive as the option Stenny mentions but it is more flexible, especially for lower income and large families. There are numerous co ops and hybrid schools and faithful families get that people will do what works for them and not look down their noses at others. This turf war stuff is a real shame.
Unless Diocese of SD can make it financially and spatially possible for all Catholic children in its parishes to attend Catholic schools, I believe the Diocese should accommodate Catholic homeschool & charter school groups on its properties. This would acknowledge the need for educational alternatives to the growing disaster of public education culture at this time. The Diocese should show ACCOMPANIMENT with families doing their best to educate their children according to Catholic teachings even if they can't afford Catholic school tuition. The Diocese should open bridges between homeschooling groups and Catholic schools. Allow homeschoolers to participate (for a reasonable fee) certain academic classes, join/try out for sports teams-band-drama. I think it's fair to require school groups to teach sacraments from curriculum/programs approved by the Diocese, but it's also expected the Diocese will have investigated AND APPROVED a number of appropriate curriculum resources (some of which should be reasonably priced). The Catholic Church teaches preferential treatment of the poor. Well, homeschooling is what working class & poor use to educate their children rather than subject the children to public school political & sex rev fads. Cardinal McElroy, do not drive away your homeschooling families. Find out about them. They are people who care more about their children than riches or entertainment or an easy life. I'm a mom who children ended up being in public schools, homeschool, private school, Catholic school before they graduated HS. I've taught public ed, library, confirmation, Catechesis of the Good Shepherd. I have strong opinions about education. One of them is homeschooling must be an option for Catholic parents & a Diocese should not make it harder for them.
Yes. I would love to see homeschooling, especially Catholic homeschooling, expand among lower income families who might feel trapped in a bad public school. Some public schools in my area are still decent, but the overall picture isn’t great and I want families to have actual, faith-filled options.
Nobody will like this reality - yes, parents are their children’s’ first teachers in the faith. But the Archdiocese of San Diego and Cardinal McElroy - like it or not - are the MAGISTERIUM.
A very wise deacon in a former parish - when I expressed frustration at not being welcome to add value to parish “infrastructure” - told me “you can’t fight city hall”. Nor do I want to.
I'm fairly confident that Magisterial authority, given that it must be related to faith and morals, does not apply to the question of who may use parish space.
They have legislative and judicial authority, which is what is being used here, and which was given to them for our good and the glory of God. It's also what was used to condemn St. Joan of Arc, who I hope will pray for the homeschoolers of San Diego.
I’m speculating that if homeschoolers “create their own sacrament prep programs”, then preparedness is judged by the Archdiocese/Pastor and may somehow impinge on magisterial authority or truth (e.g. sacramental theology). Thanks
I'm pretty sure the parish prep programs and Catholic schools have the same problem. The obvious solution would be for the pastor to examine the children before allowing them to receive the Sacraments.
Besides which, that is one explanation the bishop has not given, and I really can't see why he'd hide that reason, and be perfectly willing to point to competition with high-tuition Catholic schools. The second one seems considerably more embarrassing.
He will have a hard time arguing the insufficiency of the Holy Bible and Baltimore Catechism many of those families probably use for the basis of their religious education. Our accredited homeschool, based in California, uses the Bible and BC (or appropriately simplified summaries) as spine texts from the outset of elementary school.
Yeah, I expect actually implementing pastoral examinations would cause considerably more consternation for parish CCD/Catholic school programs than for homeschoolers. And also for the pastors, who would suddenly be required to be involved in religious formation, and also to enforce actual standards. There are plenty of parishioners who will become irrationally angry at the notion that their party will not take place, due to the child knowing too little about the reason for it.
It makes sense for the bishop to not make that argument - he would lose.
All of this makes me so grateful for my own parish. Our faith formation program is solid and a great complement to what we do at home. Sacrament prep for Reconciliation and Holy Eucharist is done in addition to the main faith formation program, and our DRE meets individually with the parents of all sacrament prep children, regardless of how they are schooled.
Yeah. My current parish has a solid program too (part of it is the same I was homeschooled with), and the priests are involved (they teach some of the classes). At my brother's parish, the priest actually does do an oral examination (conversational) and has been known to keep kids back if they aren't ready. It's always encouraging to hear about the good parishes out there.
You're entirely correct Joe. The pastor's job is this, with official guidance from the diocese. Why then the top-down OSFA declaration (not guidance) response from the chancery, if not to just wash hands of the whole problem? What happened to 'meeting people where they're at?'
I'm not sure why the bishop wouldn't prefer schools run by Catholics according to the teachings and traditions of the Church over secular public schools. His statement not to endorse particular education options is bizarre. Catholic homeschooling is in fact Catholic even if not run by diocesan employees
In the Cardinal's Sept. 25 statement, there are four principles listed. But the core of it is this:
"...housing home school related activities in the parish will inevitably create the impression that the Church is endorsing a parallel educational model..."
In other words, Cardinal McElroy and the San Diego Presbyteral Council explicitly do *not* endorse that parallel educational model -- i.e. homeschooling.
Despite their subsequent insistence that the diocese "supports the decision of a growing number of parents to choose home-schooling for their children," there is no content to that claim. They just said they do not endorse homeschooling as an educational model in parallel to the parochial school system! *How* does the diocese support the decision of Catholic parents to homeschool? Does it do anything? Or are those words of support a mere platitude?
I am not a fan of Cardinal McElroy. And home schooling is awesome. But I do not think home schoolers should have separate programs from the standard parish setting. I also would argue that Catholic school students should participate in their parish sacramental prep.
Part of Catholic formation is forming community in the local parish setting. Unless the parish is consistently teaching false doctrines, it is important for kids to participate in all aspects of parish live. Even if the religious ed program is insipid and lacking in depth.
Insipid, superficial religious ed programs teach children that the Faith is insipid and superficial. It's not a mere absence of good.
Also, before insisting that children spend a decade or so in bad religious education, try doing that to yourself, as an adult, for 10 years - and consider that it is effectively longer and more formative for them.
I homeschool, and I teach a saint class to homeschoolers during the day at our parish. This would be not allowed by McIlroy, which is ridiculous. And for the record, my kids do attend parish PREP classes, as do most of the homeschool families here. But saying homeschoolers can't reserve a classroom at the parish during the day makes no sense. Are retirees also not allowed to do Bible study during the day just because some people work during those hours?
One hopes that His Eminence is not driven by a concern that homeschool students might receive a catechetical program that will enable them to retain the Faith as adults. However, given Bishop Paprocki's highlighting of McElroy's manifest heretical views, this is a dim hope.
"The Diocese supports the decision of a growing number of parents to choose home-schooling for their children,” except that they will do nothing to actually support such decisions and will instead make homeschoolers pariahs, all while embracing the AUSCP, gay marriage advocacy groups, and trans groups that support castrating children.
Well, at least he said it plainly this time.
lol sob 🤦🏽♀️
The updated statement reads much more clearly like a (financial/enrollment) turf war between parochial schools and homeschooling, with a gloss of the good Cardinal assuming that families where parochial religious ed isn’t working aren’t good faith community members.
Particularly since non-Catholic educational groups are allowed, with approval and payment.
I am curious about that - I wonder if the diocese considers charter schools or non-Catholic private schools to be less of a competitor? Where I live, many empty Catholic schools are rented out to other private or charter schools or in some cases even regular public schools that have to temporarily vacate their building for whatever reason.
I'm more wondering about why the diocese considers homeschooling to be competition, rather than cooperation. The goal is to get children educated and formed well, particularly in the Catholic Faith, not to make tuition money. It's the non-Catholic and public schools that are in opposition to that.
There are a lot of homeschoolers that would be perfectly fine with a hybrid solution, where their kids do some things (like sports, or maybe a class the parents are weak on) in a conventional school. As a general rule, (there are exceptions) this is denied. Colleges don't refuse to let people take classes by ones and twos, it's children's schools that want full control.
"The statement also noted that the new diocesan policy was approved by the Presbyteral Council by a vote of 13-1."
-Interesting. Considering that homeschooled Catholic children in the diocese make up a small percentage of students and the makeup of the Presbyteral Council is unknown (how many of them even HAVE school age children, know anybody who does, or is free from unfounded bias against them), it's somewhat surprising that there was a single NO vote.
It is like polling a pack of wolves with one sheep on whether or not the sheep should be eaten. The head wolf has spoken.
A presbyteral council (autocorrect is convinced I meant Presbyterian) is made of priests, so I just assume the outlier is the one who was homeschooled. Statistically speaking.
Good catch, I didn't think about that. I stand corrected.
As a parent of two children in Catholic Schools in San Diego, the Cardinal should consider that our parish schools are cost-prohibitive for many families, especially families with numerous children. We live in one of the most expensive cities in America. Perhaps the local Church could fund more scholarship opportunities for faithful families to be able to afford their local parish school instead of the growing number of non-Catholics (who should be welcomed, but not at the expense of Catholic families).
Except they're bankrupt!
Maybe if diocesan schools were more faithful to the church and offered financial flexibility to middle and lower income parents there would be families that would choose those schools over homeschooling.
The state of Ohio pretty much now has open season on private school funding by vouchers.
What do the Catholic schools do? They conveniently raise tuition to absorb the vouchers (taxpayer money). And Catholic school enrollment remains flat, the vouchers are inducing zero enrollment growth.
Pick you subsidy wisely, the good government may just tax you for both public and private school instead of just public school.
https://www.statenews.org/section/the-ohio-newsroom/2024-06-17/school-voucher-use-has-surged-in-ohio-but-private-school-enrollment-isnt-rising-with-it
I had asked several pastors in the diocese of Cleveland and all of them have had an increase in enrollment in their grade schools this year.
Not entirely true; only state charter schools are funded by vouchers. I work at a non-chartered private school in Ohio that would greatly benefit from the voucher program but we are ineligible because we are not chartered.
I do agree, however, that it is a real shame that enrollment levels across the board have not gone up, likely because the new scholarship opportunity is not being advertised on a school-by-school basis. It is, of course, entirely just that those families already paying taxes for public schools and extra for private schools can now stop paying double for their children's education, but the expansion is not currently achieving what it was intended to do.
But the diocese is bankrupt!
Given the cardinal's support for ordaining women to the priesthood, why should any parent trust that the Diocese of San Diego's Catholic schools faithfully teach the Faith & not the cardinal's personal "Catholicism"?
Our Catholic schools suck. They are apostasy factories, and not even that great academically. We need to stop telling ourselves pleasantries and platitudes to make us feel better. We need to be brutally honest about how terrible 99.999% of Catholic schools are in the US. They are totally broken spiritually and academically, and we need to be very real with ourselves about that.
If only people truly knew how bad things really are. There's far too many points of critical failure to list in a single comment (or even a single thread), because the "Catholic/parochial school model" is totally broken. It's not just a question of better funding or of reforming certain schools; the whole model is so bankrupt and broken that it's nigh-unfixable.
I graduated from one of the "best Catholic schools" in the state of Wisconsin, a large well-funded K-12 institution. That same school has a 1% "Catholic retention rate" over 10 years post-graduation, meaning 99% of students apostasize within 10 years in average.
You are fully entitled to your personal sentiment or opinion. But using “Trumpian superlatives” is not convincing. And how can you correlate a 99% apostasy rate to only your single Catholic school when the US church overall has been such a living, breathing debacle (sex abuse scandal and cover-ups, financial mismanagement, near-schism over traditionalist “beauty” vs. Sacrosanctum Concilium paragraph knowing/active/fruitful participation) the last 40-50 years?
I too am demoralized after well over 60 years, but Catholic schools (at least of my era, the 1970’s and what I see thereafter in parishes of my travels) are way farther down the list for realities sending the faithful out the exits.
I’m sure there are facts supporting a wide array of perspectives and spare all of us more “Trumpian superlatives” somewhere near infinity.
I think he is saying that his school, having polled the graduates, has a 1% retention rate. I think it is not a superlative, and no one brought up Trump.
From what I understand, the average retention rate for Catholic children in general is something like 7%, so horrifically bad. But you would expect a revered Catholic school to do much better for their Catholic students, not much worse.
A related personal aside: I attended K-12 Catholic school. Had a “religious ed” class each year. When I reverted in my 20s, I was floored to discover that a bishop was a “successor to the apostles” and that an unbroken line of ordination connected him to one of the 12. I grew up thinking that if you were a priest for long enough, eventually you just got a pay rise and a funny hat. That’s the level of catechesis we received.
I don’t know anyone from my class who authentically practices, outside of one friend who I’ve been trying to nudge into reinvigorating his faith (though he lives far away, he’s an amazing dude).
"Trumpian what???" How did American electoral politics sneak into a discussion of Catholic education, even in the U.S.
Sure glad I'm Canadian.
Easy… it’s the most accurate metaphor for “magnanimous everything”… no need for shorts in a knot
It didn’t sneak in, Joe just dumped it in there for no reason. Total red herring.
You have TDS.
That’s a compliment - thank you
I hope the bishops are discussing this because it fits with my anecdotal observations, too. I know mature adults, young adults, and in between who matriculated from Catholic schools and know nearly zero about how to articulate their Faith or their reasons for holding it. And while an ability to write a Thomistic thesis is not necessary for salvation or earnest and fruitful living of the Faith, complete ignorance makes a soul an easy target.
I am sorry to hear of your experience and of the failure of many Catholic schools like the one you attended. It does not, however, represent the whole of the present reality. As a parent with school age children and many such friends, calling the project of Catholic schools futile doesn’t ring true.
It doesn’t seem as though you’re aware of the Institute for Catholic Liberal Education, for instance, and it’s affiliate schools. There’s a serious change going on in Catholic education, and it’s not limited to those adopting the “classical model.”
Of course we can’t know how many present students will hold to the faith amidst a hostile culture. But there’s reason to believe that some of our schools offer the best chance for many of their students.
It’s probably not the majority of schools at this point, but the demographics are trending in that direction.
ICLE does good work, but how many of its affiliated schools are actually part of the parochial or diocesan school systems? A lot of the best Catholic schools, like the Chesterton network, are actually independent and "in the Catholic tradition", not Catholic in the sense of being subject to the bishops.
Did you know that I used to be a teacher in Catholic schools? Did you know I’m very well aware of the ICLE, and even attended their annual conference and workshops?
Maybe it’s your experience that’s not reflective of the overwhelming trend?
“America is car-dependent” “That’s not true, my friends and I are all from NYC and we all use public transit”
Most people on the internet here know you as their guy with dead Lybian dictator as profile pic… hardly screams average Catholic school teacher and you didn’t mention you were a teacher in your initial comment.
In Australia the average level of practice of families in Catholic Schools is… 2%. Ie, out of 100 students, two go to mass at least once a month. And half those kids stop going to mass within 12 months of graduating. The only Mass that the average Catholic school student attends is the ones provided during school hours. Australia has a large and well funded Catholic school system with about 70% of funding being provided by the state, in exchange for catholic schools educating 1/3 of all Australian Children for a nominal fee (compared to fully private schools where a ‘cheap one’ starts at $20k a year).
Bishop Anthony Fisher (I think, I’m conversation) once described Catholic schools as a vaccine against Catholicism… it exposed kids to just enough Catholicism to make them immune to it for life!
Sounds like a parish needs to start a school employing an innovative model where most schooling is done by parents, sometimes collectively in a schoolroom setting and sometimes separately at home, with the parish providing educational oversight. Such a model would reduce costs for parishes and families, increase access to Catholic education, facilitate greater parental involvement in the education of their children, and improve fellowship between members of the parish, compared to the traditional model. It’s a win-win-win-win.
Hybrid classical schools in my area fill up as fast as they open registration. None in my area is Catholic, but if my diocese opened one they would max it for numbers without a doubt.
My kids attend a classical Catholic school and it has been at maximum enrollment every year since it opened. It's not a diocesan school, and it's probably not as inexpensive as the option Stenny mentions but it is more flexible, especially for lower income and large families. There are numerous co ops and hybrid schools and faithful families get that people will do what works for them and not look down their noses at others. This turf war stuff is a real shame.
Unless Diocese of SD can make it financially and spatially possible for all Catholic children in its parishes to attend Catholic schools, I believe the Diocese should accommodate Catholic homeschool & charter school groups on its properties. This would acknowledge the need for educational alternatives to the growing disaster of public education culture at this time. The Diocese should show ACCOMPANIMENT with families doing their best to educate their children according to Catholic teachings even if they can't afford Catholic school tuition. The Diocese should open bridges between homeschooling groups and Catholic schools. Allow homeschoolers to participate (for a reasonable fee) certain academic classes, join/try out for sports teams-band-drama. I think it's fair to require school groups to teach sacraments from curriculum/programs approved by the Diocese, but it's also expected the Diocese will have investigated AND APPROVED a number of appropriate curriculum resources (some of which should be reasonably priced). The Catholic Church teaches preferential treatment of the poor. Well, homeschooling is what working class & poor use to educate their children rather than subject the children to public school political & sex rev fads. Cardinal McElroy, do not drive away your homeschooling families. Find out about them. They are people who care more about their children than riches or entertainment or an easy life. I'm a mom who children ended up being in public schools, homeschool, private school, Catholic school before they graduated HS. I've taught public ed, library, confirmation, Catechesis of the Good Shepherd. I have strong opinions about education. One of them is homeschooling must be an option for Catholic parents & a Diocese should not make it harder for them.
Yes. I would love to see homeschooling, especially Catholic homeschooling, expand among lower income families who might feel trapped in a bad public school. Some public schools in my area are still decent, but the overall picture isn’t great and I want families to have actual, faith-filled options.
Nobody will like this reality - yes, parents are their children’s’ first teachers in the faith. But the Archdiocese of San Diego and Cardinal McElroy - like it or not - are the MAGISTERIUM.
A very wise deacon in a former parish - when I expressed frustration at not being welcome to add value to parish “infrastructure” - told me “you can’t fight city hall”. Nor do I want to.
I'm fairly confident that Magisterial authority, given that it must be related to faith and morals, does not apply to the question of who may use parish space.
They have legislative and judicial authority, which is what is being used here, and which was given to them for our good and the glory of God. It's also what was used to condemn St. Joan of Arc, who I hope will pray for the homeschoolers of San Diego.
I’m speculating that if homeschoolers “create their own sacrament prep programs”, then preparedness is judged by the Archdiocese/Pastor and may somehow impinge on magisterial authority or truth (e.g. sacramental theology). Thanks
I'm pretty sure the parish prep programs and Catholic schools have the same problem. The obvious solution would be for the pastor to examine the children before allowing them to receive the Sacraments.
Besides which, that is one explanation the bishop has not given, and I really can't see why he'd hide that reason, and be perfectly willing to point to competition with high-tuition Catholic schools. The second one seems considerably more embarrassing.
He will have a hard time arguing the insufficiency of the Holy Bible and Baltimore Catechism many of those families probably use for the basis of their religious education. Our accredited homeschool, based in California, uses the Bible and BC (or appropriately simplified summaries) as spine texts from the outset of elementary school.
Yeah, I expect actually implementing pastoral examinations would cause considerably more consternation for parish CCD/Catholic school programs than for homeschoolers. And also for the pastors, who would suddenly be required to be involved in religious formation, and also to enforce actual standards. There are plenty of parishioners who will become irrationally angry at the notion that their party will not take place, due to the child knowing too little about the reason for it.
It makes sense for the bishop to not make that argument - he would lose.
All of this makes me so grateful for my own parish. Our faith formation program is solid and a great complement to what we do at home. Sacrament prep for Reconciliation and Holy Eucharist is done in addition to the main faith formation program, and our DRE meets individually with the parents of all sacrament prep children, regardless of how they are schooled.
Yeah. My current parish has a solid program too (part of it is the same I was homeschooled with), and the priests are involved (they teach some of the classes). At my brother's parish, the priest actually does do an oral examination (conversational) and has been known to keep kids back if they aren't ready. It's always encouraging to hear about the good parishes out there.
You're entirely correct Joe. The pastor's job is this, with official guidance from the diocese. Why then the top-down OSFA declaration (not guidance) response from the chancery, if not to just wash hands of the whole problem? What happened to 'meeting people where they're at?'
I'm not sure why the bishop wouldn't prefer schools run by Catholics according to the teachings and traditions of the Church over secular public schools. His statement not to endorse particular education options is bizarre. Catholic homeschooling is in fact Catholic even if not run by diocesan employees
I didn't spot a link to the full Sept. 25 statement in the article, but here it is:
https://sdcatholic.org/news-release/cardinals-statement-on-home-school-use-of-parish-buildings/
In the Cardinal's Sept. 25 statement, there are four principles listed. But the core of it is this:
"...housing home school related activities in the parish will inevitably create the impression that the Church is endorsing a parallel educational model..."
In other words, Cardinal McElroy and the San Diego Presbyteral Council explicitly do *not* endorse that parallel educational model -- i.e. homeschooling.
Despite their subsequent insistence that the diocese "supports the decision of a growing number of parents to choose home-schooling for their children," there is no content to that claim. They just said they do not endorse homeschooling as an educational model in parallel to the parochial school system! *How* does the diocese support the decision of Catholic parents to homeschool? Does it do anything? Or are those words of support a mere platitude?
I am not a fan of Cardinal McElroy. And home schooling is awesome. But I do not think home schoolers should have separate programs from the standard parish setting. I also would argue that Catholic school students should participate in their parish sacramental prep.
Part of Catholic formation is forming community in the local parish setting. Unless the parish is consistently teaching false doctrines, it is important for kids to participate in all aspects of parish live. Even if the religious ed program is insipid and lacking in depth.
Insipid, superficial religious ed programs teach children that the Faith is insipid and superficial. It's not a mere absence of good.
Also, before insisting that children spend a decade or so in bad religious education, try doing that to yourself, as an adult, for 10 years - and consider that it is effectively longer and more formative for them.
I homeschool, and I teach a saint class to homeschoolers during the day at our parish. This would be not allowed by McIlroy, which is ridiculous. And for the record, my kids do attend parish PREP classes, as do most of the homeschool families here. But saying homeschoolers can't reserve a classroom at the parish during the day makes no sense. Are retirees also not allowed to do Bible study during the day just because some people work during those hours?
One hopes that His Eminence is not driven by a concern that homeschool students might receive a catechetical program that will enable them to retain the Faith as adults. However, given Bishop Paprocki's highlighting of McElroy's manifest heretical views, this is a dim hope.
"The Diocese supports the decision of a growing number of parents to choose home-schooling for their children,” except that they will do nothing to actually support such decisions and will instead make homeschoolers pariahs, all while embracing the AUSCP, gay marriage advocacy groups, and trans groups that support castrating children.
McElroy has a funny definition of pastoral.